TI does not support ASM programming!

King Harold · Post by **King Harold** » Tue 12 Jun, 2007 8:08 am

Geachte heer [you dont need to know my name]

Bedankt voor uw e-mail aan Texas Instruments.

Tot mijn spijt moet ik u meedelen dat ik u de gevraagde informatie niet kan mededelen. Ondersteuning van het creeren van assembly programs en applicaties doen wij namelijk niet. U bent wel vrij om eigen programma's en applicaties te maken en daarvoor hebben wij onze SDK-kit beschikbaar op onze website. Meer informatie hierover kan u terugvinden op de volgende webpagina: http://education.ti.com... (URL snipped)

Opdat we eventuele toekomstige vragen zo snel mogelijk zouden kunnen behandelen, gelieve steeds het volgend klantennummer te vermelden wanneer u ons contacteert: 2251557.

Met vriendelijke groeten,

Lander De Schepper

Texas Instruments
European Customer Service Center
Education Technology

Voor verdere vragen of informatie staan wij graag tot uw beschikking. U kunt ons emaillen naar ti-cares@ti.com of telefonisch bereiken op het nummer (020) 582 94 90 of faxen op het nummer (020) 582 94 19. Onze kantoren zijn open van maandag tot en met donderdag van 9.00 tot 17.00 en vrijdag van 10.00 tot 17.00.

Bezoek onze website op http://education.ti.com/educationportal ... index.html

Well I'm sorry it's dutch, I wrote them in english though..
I asked for information regarding the 84's USB, since all current documentation is a bit experimental and mostly acquired through analyzing disassembly of bcalls and experimentation.

As you might have guessed, they're not going to tell us anything. In hsort they're saying "have a look at our SDK, we won't give you anything else."

I don't know what they're up to.. giving us some information won't hurt them..

Jim e · Post by **Jim e** » Tue 12 Jun, 2007 9:45 am

You seem to think that they have the info written up all nice and pretty like. I doubt this greatly.

To be honest figuring out the USB wouldn't be that hard, assuming one thing, that you know USB specifications intimately. Theres a lot of documentation to that already available just by google.

Even more so most drivers can already be written without knowing much more. USB8X provides that interface well enough. Hell I could write a driver for my pen tablet just because the data being sent is simple.

As far as the wiki documentation goes, thats just because its easier to program it than it is to document it. In programing it just has to work, in documenting it also has to be understandable.

Post by **kv83** » Tue 12 Jun, 2007 11:15 am

Suprise, suprise. Why the topic? We knew this like... forever.

By the way... isn't it a little childish to hide your own name?

Post by **tr1p1ea** » Tue 12 Jun, 2007 12:09 pm

Yeah TI wont give you a lick of help really, but oh well ... sometimes its funner to just do it on your own

.

Post by **benryves** » Tue 12 Jun, 2007 12:21 pm

The only time I've contacted them I found them to be very helpful (admittedly, it was regarding error in the documentation, and they sent back an amended guide and example for which ever ROM call I was asking about - something to do with editing programs IIRC).

King Harold · Post by **King Harold** » Tue 12 Jun, 2007 2:15 pm

Suprise, suprise. Why the topic? We knew this like... forever.

It is strange anyway. Even Microsoft wants you to write programs and gives you almost everything to do that. TI, having written an OS for their calc, makes an SDK and a small, uncomplete documentation of bcalls, and doesn't really do anything to encourage you to write programs. There is nothing about it in the manual even, "AsmPrgm" is said to be the first token of uncompressed asm progs but they don't tell you what it is or how to do anything with it.

Yeah TI wont give you a lick of help really, but oh well ... sometimes its funner to just do it on your own

Of course it's fun!

But I would like to have complete documentation of every port on the calc - including USB ports, just for the sake of it but also because it's useful.

You seem to think that they have the info written up all nice and pretty like. I doubt this greatly.

How could they not have it? they build that calculator..

As far as the wiki documentation goes, thats just because its easier to program it than it is to document it. In programing it just has to work, in documenting it also has to be understandable.

But of course it is harder to make something work when it's not understandable..

By the way... isn't it a little childish to hide your own name?

No. I don't care if forum-regulars know my name, but I do mind having my name floating around on the net, and it will if starts leaking out on forums.

DigiTan · Post by **DigiTan** » Wed 13 Jun, 2007 2:35 am

Plan on offering us a translation any time soon?

This has been TI's position for over a decade. Certainly they gave up a little ground with the ASM( command, but they already have a good thing going for them and they know it. Open-source is still hot. And those communities were thriving even when almost no calculator specs were made public. Compromising their OS at this point just wouldn't make business sense.

As for USB, I'd wager it's even easier to crack than graylink/blacklink due to the vast USB publications. Anything you can't learn from usb.com, you can learn by wiretapping the USB port. Or getting a PC utility to do that for you.

Post by **kv83** » Wed 13 Jun, 2007 11:34 am

Even Microsoft wants you to write programs and gives you almost everything to do that.

That just recently. Besides you are not comparing a calculator to a PC Operating System now, are you? If they WANT you to write programs, the NEED to support it, which costs money. Money for something they are not gaining anything from, seeing their market are students who using the calcs for their studies and not to play games or install fancy asm progs.

Come on... how hard is it to understand bussiness.

How could they not have it? they build that calculator..

Welcome to the real world

Halifax · Post by **Halifax** » Wed 13 Jun, 2007 5:12 pm

Even Microsoft wants you to write programs and gives you almost everything to do that.

Yeah you are right almost. Since they are giving up their wireless protocol to any third-party developers. Not even the developers of Guitar Hero. The developers of Guitar Hero say they have asked Mircosoft more than once for their protocol to make a wireless guitar controller, but they were denied access every time.

King Harold · Post by **King Harold** » Wed 13 Jun, 2007 6:23 pm

Well that is not very nice, but Microsoft is not known for it's niceness is it..
It's just they have have all these Express Edition things and the enormous documentations on MSDN and csc.exe goes with .NET packages..
TI just makes 2 documents and a quite annoying program that can in theory connect your calc to your computer and leaves us in the dark..
Well ok Microsoft didn't document everything of windows, but a lot of it anyway.

Post by **tr1p1ea** » Wed 13 Jun, 2007 7:27 pm

I think TI would rather people use their stuff (APP's etc), not someone elses.

MS are probably working on a rival for Guitar Hero or something

.

Halifax · Post by **Halifax** » Thu 14 Jun, 2007 6:02 pm

Yeah tr1p1ea you are right. Is your calculator void from warranty if you have had any non-TI applications on it? That's what I heard.

King Harold · Post by **King Harold** » Thu 14 Jun, 2007 8:18 pm

Even if it was, you could just remove it, and no one would know it was ever on it unless it did something odd like making changes to unused pages

Would your computer with Windows be void from warranty if you had any non-Microsoft program on it?

DigiTan · Post by **DigiTan** » Fri 15 Jun, 2007 2:57 am

But again, that's not a fair comparison. Microsoft doesn't vend the system, just the OS. TI controls both. And they're very protective of their OS.

Jim e · Post by **Jim e** » Fri 15 Jun, 2007 3:47 am

I think you guys overestimate how much TI cares about their calculator division. It's definitely not the money maker.

Just check Wikipedia, the easiest way to have an opinion without the forethought.

I wouldn't doubt that we could get more info if we talk to someone who actually worked on it.