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Damn you optimists
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One with a slighter faster chip and no docs and no ASM support would be nice...Kozak wrote:I will probably also stay but the active z80 programmers in MC have to be replenished now and then.
And I have no idea where the community is going. Maybe we need a new calculator?
How about graphics acceleration, color screen, and big ram and archive?kv83 wrote:One with a slighter faster chip and no docs and no ASM support would be nice...Kozak wrote:I will probably also stay but the active z80 programmers in MC have to be replenished now and then.
And I have no idea where the community is going. Maybe we need a new calculator?... imagine, we could hack it and find out ASM all again
Err, last time I checked the 83 and 89 ARE the same shape and size, as are the 84+/SE and TI-89tiCompWiz wrote:How about graphics acceleration, color screen, and big ram and archive?kv83 wrote:One with a slighter faster chip and no docs and no ASM support would be nice...Kozak wrote:I will probably also stay but the active z80 programmers in MC have to be replenished now and then.
And I have no idea where the community is going. Maybe we need a new calculator?... imagine, we could hack it and find out ASM all again
And also, it should be the same size and shape as 89/83 so you can switch cases for exams
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would low price be reasonable as well?
That's the point. Then you can put it into an 83 case and take it to an exam that doesn't allow higher model calcs.KermMartian wrote:Err, last time I checked the 83 and 89 ARE the same shape and size, as are the 84+/SE and TI-89tiCompWiz wrote:How about graphics acceleration, color screen, and big ram and archive?kv83 wrote:One with a slighter faster chip and no docs and no ASM support would be nice...... imagine, we could hack it and find out ASM all again
And also, it should be the same size and shape as 89/83 so you can switch cases for exams
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would low price be reasonable as well?
Yes, but we still have these things, and we are better at them too. Were games better back then because we didn't know everything about the calcs? the contrary is true obviously, we're doing things with the calcs that ppl back then couldn't dream of. Like kevins basic games, like spencers zelda, grayscale, everythingcurrahee wrote:Hehe okay, we've had a few of these. Surprisingly, even TIcalc.org wrote one. If you haven't seen it, it's quite an old article but it's worth a read I believe. This topic is NOTHING NEW to those who have just joined and thought that this is the beginning of the end.
http://www.ticalc.org/community/articles/27.html
*ahem* Fellow calculator programming nerds, the issue of the state of the TI Community has been a long argued topic. If I can pinpoint exactly, it started to begin when the big programming groups and people started to dismantle. Following up on Justin's argument (Ticalc.org link), things start to die when creativity falls.
Back then when everything was fresh and new, my god there where loads of things to explore about the unexplored hardware! We're talking about ASM language development (Ion), Overclocking (I believe you could run your z80 6MHz 3x of the advertised speed), calculator sound (Calculators emit radio waves via the port. Attach a calc-2-calc (old link, not the shitty new USB links) on the port, have the other end of the link near a radio reciever at an empty AM channel and hear your calculator sing!), hell even backlights!
the decline of the community as you say doesnt exist. Ever since i joined, the activity has been rising. More projects are coming all the time, one even more awesome than the otherHowever this "Golden Era" of the TI community soon fell out. Lots of people became inactive then, so the true decline of the TI community has happened long before than us people so concerned might have thought.
Graphics ARE important in a game. Obviously. Do you want to say that we should all play menu based basic beer baron games? Graphics should complement the gameplay though, not worsen it.I believe what Justin says in his article is correct. Not only is there little creativity but also with today's advanced graphics systems, that's what people are starting to care about the most. Graphics, graphics, graphics. What do people look for in games today? Graphics. What do you see in most game comments now-a-days? Graphics. If the gfx are good, then the people like it. If they suck, my god the game sucks. It just works like that. The TI Calculators are somewhat more complex- I think people do understand the limitations of the TI hardware. So in part, what keeps this thing at least ticking is the belief that people already understand what the calculator is capable of.
However, graphics in a way DO kill the community. I won't put grayscale here. Although Duck did a commendable job with grayscale I don't think people love it so much because it's not as flickerless as it should be. If you have something new and the people like it, then people will benchmark it. Then people will only care about games with good graphics. Maybe some say that will be better since we will have purdy looking games. This kills creativity though- i bet there are a LOT of people who have such great ideas for games but can't do graphics. Graphics hurts the community in this way- i'll admit even I do it *feels ashamed*. Then again who doesn't? Who hasn't seen a basic game and shunned it because it didn't have graphics?
Spencer is not Maxcoderz. Kevin is not Maxcoderz. UTI does more than just Nimbus, Kevin actually used to be UTI.HOWEVER I would also like to add that the eventual oblieration and destruction of the TI Community (sounds heart-warming doesn't it?) is being delayed. All thanks in part to Maxcoderz and Detached. As well as notable individuals such as Michael Vincent and Kevin. Maybe even UTI if they ever get Numbus rolling on the floor. However, one promising sign is always that everyone is here and active. You can't have an alive community with everyone being inactive. That means the community is dead
or rather ....
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I would especially like to commend Maxcoderz for weathering some critical moments. Especially when the community board has been hacked twice. And the saving of themselves by merging with Alienhead Productions. I believe this is the reason why both communities are still alive today. If the merge had not happened, both communities would have idled away. That's right. No FF:TOM 2 (though the demo was out when the merging process was coming), no Kevin's Zelda, no Spencer's Zelda, no *blah blah*. So I would like to point out a critical move in the Community was performed by Maxcoderz and Alienhead.
New people will always come with new calcs. As long as calcs are needed in school, young people will program for it.Ahh good ol Detached Solutions with Michael Vincent and Kirk Meyer. of course if you know, Michael is still a strong force in the 83+ scene. With such development as the first "other" Ti-OS in development. While there have been moments that might have led to the Detached inactivity, there have always been new surprises that seem to keep the group alive. Groups are more important than individual people, I think. Groups give more activity to a community than just one person.
And so with the crappily written statement of the TI community- nothing has been concluded. Oh crap! So what I want to say is that the TI community is fading BUT there have been moments to delay it's descent to the beyond. With the unfortunate events happening in the gaming world which I would like to add, influences the TI world in a way, there IS a GUARNTEED destruction point waiting for the TI Community.
To add everything up, you sound like a grumpy old man that thinks things were better in the old days. THEY WERE NOT. New calcs give new oppurtunities, and new programmers will always come. Graphics design is a part of creativity too. Maybe the ti-community will die, but not in the next 10 years.Can some people stay in the end? Maybe. Unfortunately it is more like no one. Not even Maxcoderz, can stay standing. If you're 33 are you still going to contribute to the TI Community? no, you'd be working on life. We have seen it all- it is due by luck and interest from some people that we're even still here today. Successive delays are being brought upon by, for example, Spencer. I mean out of the blue one day he announced Zelda and posted a screenie. Took us all by surprise didnt it?![]()
that doesn't mean I believe everyone should pack up and leave. Remember that when I say GUARNTEED DESTRUCTION POINT, it can be tomorrow (highly unlikely) to after 30 years (Will TI calcs even be around by then???). We do have the ability to push that day even further. If new people are willing to explore. Willing to save the community. Not just by talking, but by developing. Be it in BASIC or Assembly, crappy or perfect. Also to point out in Justin's article, there needs to be support. No flame wars saying how much crap something is. In fact, that's a reason why Kevin left if I can remember. Or not.
So not only do many users completely unappreciate what these programmers are doing, but there's also been some other problems with the community. If you look through the ticalc.org comment sections for the news posts (the ticalc.org comment system is just about the only place in the TI community where how all of us think and feel is seen), you'll see that most of them are completely off-topic. Others are hostile. Then there's advertising. And flames. Where did all of this come from? Everything is shown to get corrupted over time (as the books Brave New World, Lord of the Flies, and even Revelation tell us), but I didn't think this could be true for the TI community! I mean.. there's not that many of us. And come on people, these are graphing calculators! I can see that the TI community is taking a toll for the worst, and I don't know how/if it will turn around. I'm not knocking everybody of course. Thank ticalc.org for giving me a place to put this. Thank Dimension TI for an innovative archive index. Thank the TI-Files' friendly environment. Thank all the numerous programmers out there from before and now that have contributed.
I don't know if I really want comments to this article. The TI community doesn't need another 100k+ comment page to sift through. All I ask is that we clean up our act. I'd like to clean up the video game industry if I could, but I think I'd have more of a chance with this one.
Grayscale wasn't a dream back then, there are several original NES Zelda games out there on ticalc.org's archives just to name a few.Yes, but we still have these things, and we are better at them too. Were games better back then because we didn't know everything about the calcs? the contrary is true obviously, we're doing things with the calcs that ppl back then couldn't dream of. Like kevins basic games, like spencers zelda, grayscale, everything
A lot of websites have shut down during the years of idle-ness or are not being updated anymore. When I say decline I meant there are more losses than new things popping up. Ever since my brief idling period and when I came back it seemed the community has rebounded a little bit but not by much. Omnimaga seems all but gone now. Mergers are keeping things alive. I haven't seen any new programming groups.the decline of the community as you say doesnt exist. Ever since i joined, the activity has been rising. More projects are coming all the time, one even more awesome than the other
I said PEOPLE AND COMMUNITY. I was NOT IMPLYING that they were part of groups.Spencer is not Maxcoderz. Kevin is not Maxcoderz. UTI does more than just Nimbus, Kevin actually used to be UTI.
To add everything up, you sound like one of those people who made Kevin leave. New calcs may give new oppertunities, but the "new calcs" have been so far rebranded TIs.
PostPosted: Wed Nov 09, 2005 9:16 am Post subject: Re: The state of the TI Community (Oh my gawd! not another o
currahee wrote:
Hehe okay, we've had a few of these. Surprisingly, even TIcalc.org wrote one. If you haven't seen it, it's quite an old article but it's worth a read I believe. This topic is NOTHING NEW to those who have just joined and thought that this is the beginning of the end.
http://www.ticalc.org/community/articles/27.html
*ahem* Fellow calculator programming nerds Cool , the issue of the state of the TI Community has been a long argued topic. If I can pinpoint exactly, it started to begin when the big programming groups and people started to dismantle. Following up on Justin's argument (Ticalc.org link), things start to die when creativity falls.
Back then when everything was fresh and new, my god there where loads of things to explore about the unexplored hardware! We're talking about ASM language development (Ion), Overclocking (I believe you could run your z80 6MHz 3x of the advertised speed Smile ), calculator sound (Calculators emit radio waves via the port. Attach a calc-2-calc (old link, not the shitty new USB links) on the port, have the other end of the link near a radio reciever at an empty AM channel and hear your calculator sing!), hell even backlights!
Yes, but we still have these things, and we are better at them too. Were games better back then because we didn't know everything about the calcs? the contrary is true obviously, we're doing things with the calcs that ppl back then couldn't dream of. Like kevins basic games, like spencers zelda, grayscale, everything
Quote:
However this "Golden Era" of the TI community soon fell out. Lots of people became inactive then, so the true decline of the TI community has happened long before than us people so concerned might have thought.
the decline of the community as you say doesnt exist. Ever since i joined, the activity has been rising. More projects are coming all the time, one even more awesome than the other
Quote:
I believe what Justin says in his article is correct. Not only is there little creativity but also with today's advanced graphics systems, that's what people are starting to care about the most. Graphics, graphics, graphics. What do people look for in games today? Graphics. What do you see in most game comments now-a-days? Graphics. If the gfx are good, then the people like it. If they suck, my god the game sucks. It just works like that. The TI Calculators are somewhat more complex- I think people do understand the limitations of the TI hardware. So in part, what keeps this thing at least ticking is the belief that people already understand what the calculator is capable of.
However, graphics in a way DO kill the community. I won't put grayscale here. Although Duck did a commendable job with grayscale I don't think people love it so much because it's not as flickerless as it should be. If you have something new and the people like it, then people will benchmark it. Then people will only care about games with good graphics. Maybe some say that will be better since we will have purdy looking games. This kills creativity though- i bet there are a LOT of people who have such great ideas for games but can't do graphics. Graphics hurts the community in this way- i'll admit even I do it *feels ashamed*. Then again who doesn't? Who hasn't seen a basic game and shunned it because it didn't have graphics?
Graphics ARE important in a game. Obviously. Do you want to say that we should all play menu based basic beer baron games? Graphics should complement the gameplay though, not worsen it.
Quote:
HOWEVER I would also like to add that the eventual oblieration and destruction of the TI Community (sounds heart-warming doesn't it? Very Happy ) is being delayed. All thanks in part to Maxcoderz and Detached. As well as notable individuals such as Michael Vincent and Kevin. Maybe even UTI if they ever get Numbus rolling on the floor. However, one promising sign is always that everyone is here and active. You can't have an alive community with everyone being inactive. That means the community is dead Smile or rather .... Sad
I would especially like to commend Maxcoderz for weathering some critical moments. Especially when the community board has been hacked twice. And the saving of themselves by merging with Alienhead Productions. I believe this is the reason why both communities are still alive today. If the merge had not happened, both communities would have idled away. That's right. No FF:TOM 2 (though the demo was out when the merging process was coming), no Kevin's Zelda, no Spencer's Zelda, no *blah blah*. So I would like to point out a critical move in the Community was performed by Maxcoderz and Alienhead.
Spencer is not Maxcoderz. Kevin is not Maxcoderz. UTI does more than just Nimbus, Kevin actually used to be UTI.
Quote:
Ahh good ol Detached Solutions with Michael Vincent and Kirk Meyer. of course if you know, Michael is still a strong force in the 83+ scene. With such development as the first "other" Ti-OS in development. While there have been moments that might have led to the Detached inactivity, there have always been new surprises that seem to keep the group alive. Groups are more important than individual people, I think. Groups give more activity to a community than just one person.
And so with the crappily written statement of the TI community- nothing has been concluded. Oh crap! So what I want to say is that the TI community is fading BUT there have been moments to delay it's descent to the beyond. With the unfortunate events happening in the gaming world which I would like to add, influences the TI world in a way, there IS a GUARNTEED destruction point waiting for the TI Community.
New people will always come with new calcs. As long as calcs are needed in school, young people will program for it.
Quote:
Can some people stay in the end? Maybe. Unfortunately it is more like no one. Not even Maxcoderz, can stay standing. If you're 33 are you still going to contribute to the TI Community? no, you'd be working on life. We have seen it all- it is due by luck and interest from some people that we're even still here today. Successive delays are being brought upon by, for example, Spencer. I mean out of the blue one day he announced Zelda and posted a screenie. Took us all by surprise didnt it? Wink
that doesn't mean I believe everyone should pack up and leave. Remember that when I say GUARNTEED DESTRUCTION POINT, it can be tomorrow (highly unlikely) to after 30 years (Will TI calcs even be around by then??? Sad ). We do have the ability to push that day even further. If new people are willing to explore. Willing to save the community. Not just by talking, but by developing. Be it in BASIC or Assembly, crappy or perfect. Also to point out in Justin's article, there needs to be support. No flame wars saying how much crap something is. In fact, that's a reason why Kevin left if I can remember. Or not.
Quote:
So not only do many users completely unappreciate what these programmers are doing, but there's also been some other problems with the community. If you look through the ticalc.org comment sections for the news posts (the ticalc.org comment system is just about the only place in the TI community where how all of us think and feel is seen), you'll see that most of them are completely off-topic. Others are hostile. Then there's advertising. And flames. Where did all of this come from? Everything is shown to get corrupted over time (as the books Brave New World, Lord of the Flies, and even Revelation tell us), but I didn't think this could be true for the TI community! I mean.. there's not that many of us. And come on people, these are graphing calculators! I can see that the TI community is taking a toll for the worst, and I don't know how/if it will turn around. I'm not knocking everybody of course. Thank ticalc.org for giving me a place to put this. Thank Dimension TI for an innovative archive index. Thank the TI-Files' friendly environment. Thank all the numerous programmers out there from before and now that have contributed.
I don't know if I really want comments to this article. The TI community doesn't need another 100k+ comment page to sift through. All I ask is that we clean up our act. I'd like to clean up the video game industry if I could, but I think I'd have more of a chance with this one.
To add everything up, you sound like a grumpy old man that thinks things were better in the old days. THEY WERE NOT. New calcs give new oppurtunities, and new programmers will always come. Graphics design is a part of creativity too. Maybe the ti-community will die, but not in the next 10 years.
Dang, tr1p1ea, my mouth hurts from when you took the words out of them!*\These community doomsday articles are getting out of hand.